179: The Invested Wives: The True Financial Dynamic of Married Couples

Welcome to the Invested Dads Podcast, simplifying financial topics so that you can take action and make your financial situation better, helping you to understand the current world of financial planning and investments. Here are your hosts, Josh Robb and Austin Wilson.

Jenna Wilson:

Hey, hey, hey. Welcome back to the Invested Dads Podcast, a podcast where we take you on a journey to better your financial future. I am Jenna Wilson, wife of Research Analyst, Austin Wilson at Hixon Zuercher Capital Management.

Steph Robb:

And I’m Steph Robb, wife of Josh Robb, Director of Wealth Management at Hixon Zuercher Capital Management.

Austin Wilson:

That they are. There’s the wives, for the first time ever. This is going to be interesting.

Josh Robb:

We are going to have a fun time.

Austin Wilson:

We’re going to have a fun time.

Josh Robb:

We are going to be asking them some financial questions, and they are going to tell the truth-

Austin Wilson:

That’s true.

Josh Robb:

… about the pros and cons of being married to two people in the finance industry.

Austin Wilson:

I’m sure it’s not all Rosie.

Josh Robb:

Probably not.

Austin Wilson:

We’re going to find out, but we would love it if you’d subscribe, if you’re not subscribed, and visit our website, sign up for our weekly newsletter where you’ll get nice show notes and an email every single Thursday when our new episode comes out. That’s what you can do. But as Josh said, today, talking about finance and what’s going on in the finance world, what they know, and what their thoughts are on certain things. So, it’s going to be exciting. Josh, do you want to get us started? We’ve got a list of questions to ask our lovely brides.

 

[1:21] – How Household Finances Work & What Tips the Wives Have 

Josh Robb:

All right. We’ll first start with the question of how do you guys do finances in your household? Well, our households I guess, together. But what is it like to manage money together as a couple? Any tips you’ve learned over the years and any thoughts on how you manage the money?

Steph Robb:

Not well. I do not finance well in our house, aside from… I spend a lot of the money. That would be how I finance in our house. Jenna?

Jenna Wilson:

Yeah. Finances have always been an open conversation in our marriage, but Austin is definitely the one who does the managing. And every once in a while, I just say, “Hey, honey. What’s this account look like today?” So he’s definitely the manager, and I just trust him completely to manage it well. Any tips, I guess, would be just to have an open line of communication and make sure that you both are on the same page about how your finances are working.

Josh Robb:

Yeah. And I would say this isn’t unusual with a lot of clients that we work with, is there’s usually, in most relationships, one person who has more interest in finance and another one who says, “You know what? I’m happy to turn that over. One less stress I need to do.” And they are probably offset by other things. There’s certain things, for instance, I don’t do a lot of the clothes shopping, things like that. If I had to-

Austin Wilson:

Obviously, I see what you wear.

Josh Robb:

Not just what I wear, but for the kids.

Steph Robb:

His floral ties are all mine.

Austin Wilson:

Okay, good, good, good.

Josh Robb:

But that’s the thing is, that’s part of the budgeting, so there has to be communication between those. If she’s the one that’s taking that responsibility of making sure all of our kids’ clothes fit, which is a big deal for them when they have shoes and all that fun stuff that they grow out of every 10 minutes. The idea is, that needs to be part of the conversation with budgeting. And so, for Steph and I, this is what I do day in and day out, so it’s natural for me to know all the balances of all of our accounts and what we’re saving in retirement. And it’s not that you can’t know, right?

Steph Robb:

It’s not that I can’t know. I prefer not to know.

Josh Robb:

Yeah. Yeah.

Steph Robb:

I would say.

Josh Robb:

And so, in the 18 years we’ve been married, we’ve found a routine, a rhythm of what I do and what you do, which is nice.

Steph Robb:

Yeah.

Josh Robb:

It took us a while to get there, too, I would say.

Austin Wilson:

And I would say that it’s not for lack of ability.

Steph Robb:

No. Oh, no.

Austin Wilson:

I would totally think that you could, Jenna, manage our finances very well if you’d like to, but it just makes sense I think in our situation, just like yours, for me to handle that. But I think it’s possible for anyone to do it.

Steph Robb:

I would say too, it’s knowing your strengths and knowing your weaknesses. For me, managing finances is not something… I am a spender. So, for Josh to be able to take that on, and I know what I can spend and when I can spend it. Same with I would not trust Josh to manage our family calendar on a weekly basis.

Josh Robb:

Oh, no. That’s it.

Steph Robb:

He would have no idea what’s going on. I just think it’s a matter of he’s better at that and I prefer for him to handle that.

Austin Wilson:

So, here’s a question. Not on the agenda here.

Josh Robb:

Oh, boy.

Austin Wilson:

Going off script. Saver or spender? And I know the answers.

Steph Robb:

Absolute spender.

Austin Wilson:

And Josh?

Josh Robb:

Saver.

Steph Robb:

Yes.

Josh Robb:

Yeah. I’m a saver.

Jenna Wilson:

I like to spend, but I think I save more maybe. I don’t know. What do you think?

Austin Wilson:

And I like to save, but I think I spend more.

Steph Robb:

Ooh. Interesting.

Josh Robb:

Ooh. Look at that.

Austin Wilson:

Uh-huh. I think I have the heart of a spender, but the brain of a saver. It’s so funny the way we… I will fret over spending $15 on something and not pull the trigger for weeks, but then something that’s $300 comes along and I’m like, “I can justify that.”

Josh Robb:

Mm-hmm.

Austin Wilson:

It’s no problem for me to do that. But I think it’s the opposite for you, where a little thing is just no big deal, but you don’t want to spend the $100 on yourself or whatever.

Jenna Wilson:

Yeah. You have expensive hobbies.

Austin Wilson:

Hey.

Josh Robb:

Well, when you said you fret, I thought you were going to make a guitar joke on that.

 

[5:15] – What Do Jenna & Steph Know About Their Finances & What Do They Wish They Knew?

Austin Wilson:

Uh-huh. Yeah, that’s where some money goes. All right, so number two, ladies, what do you know about your finances, what don’t you know, and is there anything that you wish you did?

Jenna Wilson:

Okay. So I feel like I can know whatever I want. It’s a very open conversation in our house, but I don’t really care to know at all. Something that I do like to know is how we’re saving and how we’re saving for our daughters. And so, we do talk about that pretty frequently. And actually, we’ve talked a lot with Josh about that, about how to make decisions of saving for our kids. And so, just super grateful to have not only conversations with Austin, but also a lot of other professionals here in their office to make sure we make the best decisions with our money.

Steph Robb:

Josh likes to have what I lovingly call weekly budget lectures.

Austin Wilson:

Is it in the calendar?

Steph Robb:

Literally, every day he’ll be like, “Okay. Tonight, we’re going to talk about the budget.” And I try to avoid it as long as possible. But no, it is good. I exaggerate. Maybe it’s not every week, but it helps us see where our spending is, where our savings are, what goals we have coming up, whether that be a vacation or an experience that we want to do. So yeah, we talk about it pretty frequently. However, with that being said, I would not say I always know exactly what our finances are, because I don’t choose to listen great sometimes.

 

[6:45] – What Tracking & Budgeting Works Best?

Austin Wilson:

And I think that kind of brings up another question. What kind of tracking or budgeting works for you, and what do you use maybe?

Josh Robb:

I think the easiest is when it comes to our kind of fun spending is we just have a separate debit card, a separate account set up, and that money is not earmarked for anything besides whatever you want to use it for. And so, when you’re out, if you’re stopping and getting lunch or you’re going to the movies, you use that debit card. And as long as there’s money in that account, you don’t need to justify the expense on that one. That’s worked well for us. That’s a no-guilt spending account every paycheck. You just move some money there, and then that’s to be used for whatever. And so, for us, when it comes to budgeting, because everything else is automated, we’ve talked about this. Bills are automated, everything’s paid out of the regular checking account, so then that just becomes a use-it-for-whatever-you-want account. And I think that’s helped us.

Steph Robb:

And I think we like to do things a lot. We like to go to games, we like to go on trips, weekend getaways, that kind of thing. So I think a lot of our couple spending goes towards saving up for those kind of things.

Josh Robb:

And kids sports.

Steph Robb:

And kids sports, yes. Kids in general.

Austin Wilson:

I saw a statistic that was the average cost of raising a kid through age 17 is 300 and some thousand dollars per kid.

Steph Robb:

Yeah. I’m telling you, we have a 13-year old. He has grown three shoe sizes since the fall.

Austin Wilson:

Whoo.

Steph Robb:

Yeah. So, shoes alone with four kids in our house are expensive.

Josh Robb:

Yeah. So that’s the difference. So, she’s buying new shoes and doing a great job. I would’ve bought open-toed shoes that he can just-

Austin Wilson:

Wear forever.

Josh Robb:

They could just grow and hang over.

Austin Wilson:

That’s right.

Josh Robb:

That’d be fine. Nobody cares.

Austin Wilson:

One pair for life.

Josh Robb:

“No, you’re fine.”

Austin Wilson:

That’s right.

Steph Robb:

Oh, gosh.

Austin Wilson:

Cut the toes off your Crocs.

Josh Robb:

That’s right. Open it up, let it grow.

Austin Wilson:

And I would say, you can maybe answer a little bit better, but we have a very flexible spending and budgeting approach. And I would refer to a blog written by The Everyday Advisor, Jess Hinks, which will link in the show notes, The Financial Advisor Without a Budget. And she just really talked about having mindful spending in general. And we used to get really anal, I did, about tracking every dime, tracking every dollar, knowing where it went, categorizing it. The $.99 expense would need to get recorded, and that was a pain. And it was a stressful thing in our marriage. “I don’t care that you spend $3.00, I just need to know it and put it in there…” It was just a pain. So now, it’s very loose because we’ve done all the pre-work, where we’ve gotten all our bills paid automatically, we generally know how much money we’re bringing in, and how much we’re spending on the normal stuff, so that the discretionary items every month we don’t really fret about.

Jenna Wilson:

Ya that time period in our marriage, which was early on, when we were tracking every dime, was really stressful. And I think it was not necessary stress. I think when you’re going for a big goal like if you’re trying to pay off a big chunk of debt or something like that, that would really make sense to be strict about it. We really weren’t. We were just trying to have a budget because that’s what we were told we should do, and it didn’t really work for us.

Austin Wilson:

Didn’t really work for us.

Jenna Wilson:

So yeah. Just find what works for you so that you don’t cry over wanting to go out to eat. Multiple times.

Austin Wilson:

That’s a real example. That was low hanging fruit when I’m like, “We spent $500 eating out last month.” And like, that’s easy low hanging fruit. Let’s get rice and beans, and we’re cutting expenses.

Steph Robb:

Oh, we have that with our kids.

Austin Wilson:

Oh, my goodness yeah

Steph Robb:

After church, if you just want to do the quick McDonalds run…

Austin Wilson:

50 bucks.

Steph Robb:

It is. And that was something we were finding ourselves doing more often than we should have-

Josh Robb:

For convenience.

Steph Robb:

For convenience purposes.

Austin Wilson:

Oh, of course.

Steph Robb:

You get out of church at 12:15, hop right over there. But when I started realizing we’re dropping $50 to eat food that is not even good for us… That’s been something that we’ve been better about cutting out lately. Our kids hate that we’re cutting it out, though. We know that.

Austin Wilson:

I would say during the week we’re pretty good about planning ahead and cooking at home, except for date nights, which is Taco Shop, obviously every week.

Steph Robb:

Gillig’s Winery for us.

Josh Robb:

Ooh, that’s a good one, too. But on the weekends we’re a little bit more flexible. But again, I think at different points in your marriage, at different points in your financial situation, you have a lot more flexibility. When we were starting out, we didn’t have as much discretionary income to be able to do as much of that, but things have changed.

Steph Robb:

I also think it’s coming off of how you were raised. We were raised very differently in terms of finances. So figuring out how your mindsets work together, where it’s not just his way or my way, that took some adjusting for us, I would say.

Josh Robb:

Yeah. And I had to learn… I like to know where things are, and Steph is happy. Our Roth IRAs, she knows what we’re doing, but she doesn’t care to know the balance on a weekly basis, which again, when we’re talking budgeting, it was like, “Here’s all the data.” She didn’t want all the data. And that’s something at the very beginning when she was talking about kind of where she’s at and doesn’t have much knowledge of where everything’s at, it’s partly because over time she’s like, “I don’t really need to know that we added $100 to our Roth IRA this month.”

Steph Robb:

Yeah, it’s completely by choice.

Josh Robb:

Yeah.

Steph Robb:

It’s not like you won’t let me be a part of it. It’s I have absolutely no desire to be a part of that.

Josh Robb:

And that’s fine. But you do know that if something were to happen to me, you call Jess and Jess will help you out, and she’ll take care of it all. So that’s the key, is finding out what you need, what you want, and then communicating that way.

Jenna Wilson:

Yep. And knowing that there are other people that are there to help us as well. I think that’s probably why we don’t care, right, Steph?

Steph Robb:

Oh, absolutely.

Jenna Wilson:

Because we’re going to be okay. We’re going to be taken care of. We’re going to be guided in the right direction if anything would ever happen to you, which it better not.

Steph Robb:

Well, and I think for me, Josh and I have been together for so long. I was, what, 15 when we started dating. So, so much of my life, he’s been around, and I’ve always trusted him with so much of the finances that I don’t see any reason for that to change. And like you said, you have it set up where I could discover whatever I want. I just don’t want to. And I trust that you know what you’re doing.

 

[13:11] – Biggest Financial Lessons & Future Goals 

Austin Wilson:

All right. So, what are some things you’ve learned about finance over the years, whether it was in school or out of school, in real life situations? What are some things that you learned? And then, what are some goals you have that you’re hoping to achieve or that you’re looking at for down the road?

Jenna Wilson:

What have I learned about finances? I would say probably nothing in school, really. I don’t remember ever learning anything that’s actually applicable to everyday life, so that was a big adjustment to becoming an adult. And thankfully, the things I have learned have mostly been from Austin.

Josh Robb:

That is something you both had to learn, because you are both business owners.

Jenna Wilson:

Mm-hmm. Right.

Josh Robb:

And you’ve had to learn that there are things you have to do. And I know Austin, you probably help a little bit, and I help Steph a little bit, but you guys track all that. You guys are both running your own business where you have to be accountable, and you’ve learned that.

Austin Wilson:

That’s Jenna’s least favorite part of the whole business.

Josh Robb:

It was Steph’s too. It was Steph’s as well.

Steph Robb:

Yeah.

Josh Robb:

She didn’t get into photography to be an accountant. She got into photography to be a photographer. And same with you, Jenna. But you learn you have to do that stuff. And just tracking, that’s a headache.

Austin Wilson:

Yeah. It is.

Steph Robb:

I remember Josh trying to set me up with QuickBooks. And I was so I like, “I’m just going to need you to do this side of the business, because it’s not going to go well if I have to enter everything.” So he kind of took over that for me.

Austin Wilson:

Your accountant.

Steph Robb:

Yeah.

Jenna Wilson:

Yes.

Josh Robb:

And you have a minor in accounting, so I said, “You can do this.”

Steph Robb:

I enjoy… Here’s the thing. I enjoy the inputting of information. I don’t like realizing that I’m spending my money on things I shouldn’t be spending on.

Josh Robb:

So Steph, you brought up a story here. This photography discussion leads right into-

Steph Robb:

Oh, yes, yes.

Josh Robb:

… how we got to be around this table today.

Steph Robb:

Yes.

Josh Robb:

So why don’t you tell us a little bit about that?

Jenna Wilson:

It’s really all because of Steph.

Steph Robb:

Yeah. It is.

Austin Wilson:

Oh, yeah.

Jenna Wilson:

It’s all Steph.

Steph Robb:

I am 100% responsible for this bromance of Josh and Austin.

Austin Wilson:

This podcast.

Steph Robb:

This podcast. So, I was a wedding photographer, and I did Jenna and Austin’s wedding. And we met at your engagement shoot, is when I met Austin.

Austin Wilson:

Yep.

Steph Robb:

And right away, I would say within 20 minutes, because Josh always came to the weddings, but he did not come to the engagement shoots, within 20 minutes of meeting Austin, I said to him, “Josh and you are going to love each other on the wedding day.” And sure enough, you do.

Austin Wilson:

That was a long time ago. And we’re still putting up with each other now.

Josh Robb:

I think you were in the parking lot and fell down.

Austin Wilson:

That’s what I was about to say.

Josh Robb:

You fell into my heart is what really what happened.

Austin Wilson:

I know.

Josh Robb:

And since then…

Austin Wilson:

I think you were realizing, “Wow, we have a lot in common.”

Steph Robb:

I can think of two major groom things that have happened. One boy split his pants one time, and Austin falling completely down in a white tux might be one of my favorite groom stories ever.

Josh Robb:

Running to his truck that he was so proud of.

Austin Wilson:

Okay.

Steph Robb:

But he was running to open the door for Jenna.

Austin Wilson:

I know. It was exciting. I will say there were no pictures taken of my smokey burnout in front of the church. I lit them up.

Steph Robb:

Do you guys remember how cold it was on your wedding day?

Austin Wilson:

Oh, yeah.

Steph Robb:

I was not.

Austin Wilson:

I know. I know. And she was wearing that leopard jacket over the dress because it was like 30 degrees in December.

Jenna Wilson:

Yep. It was freezing. It was freezing.

Austin Wilson:

So that’s the story of how the Invested Dads became The Invested Dads, right?

Steph Robb:

Well, and also then, Jenna on your honeymoon.

Austin Wilson:

Yes.

Steph Robb:

They had a job opening at Hixon Zuercher. So I messaged Jenna on her honeymoon and said-

Austin Wilson:

Yes. While we’re in Punta Cana.

Steph Robb:

And said, “I know you’re on your honeymoon.”

Josh Robb:

Did you get reception there?

Steph Robb:

“But.”

Jenna Wilson:

Oh, yeah.

Steph Robb:

“Here’s this job opening. I think you’d be a great fit.” And sure enough, you were. And then, you brought Austin here.

Jenna Wilson:

Yep. Yep. It’s been awesome.

Steph Robb:

Yep.

 

[16:56] – Mom Joke of the Week

Austin Wilson:

All right. So we need to take a little bit of a break, because this is a lot of good discussion, a lot of good questions. But usually, Josh and I bring the heat with the dad jokes of the week.

Josh Robb:

Do a mom joke.

Steph Robb:

Yes.

Josh Robb:

I think we’ve got mom joke of the week today.

Steph Robb:

Okay.

Josh Robb:

A double whammy.

Steph Robb:

All right, Jenna, are you ready?

Jenna Wilson:

Let’s hear it, Steph.

Steph Robb:

Okay. Why do wives use twice as many words as their husbands?

Jenna Wilson:

That’s a good question.

Steph Robb:

Do you have any guesses, Josh?

Austin Wilson:

I’m not going to weigh in on this one.

Josh Robb:

I will get in a lot of trouble if I answer it, so no.

Steph Robb:

Because they always have to repeat themselves.

Austin Wilson:

That’s true.

Jenna Wilson:

That’s a good one. You nailed it.

Steph Robb:

Oh, thank you.

 

[17:35] – Jenna & Steph’s Biggest Financial Mistakes

Austin Wilson:

All right. Let’s continue with some good questions for our ladies here. What is one financial mistake you learned from?

Josh Robb:

You’ve got a good one.

Steph Robb:

I do. I have a good one. Okay. So when we were… A week after we’d been home from our honeymoon, right?

Josh Robb:

Or two, within the first month, for sure.

Steph Robb:

Yes. So I was kind of, when we got married, I was still in college. So we got married in June, got home from our honeymoon, and it was end of June, I would say at this time. And I still had almost two months before school started, but I wasn’t really working at this point because I was still in school. So I was a little bit like, “What am I going to do with my days?” So I took Josh to Petland.

Josh Robb:

Tell how we got to Petland.

Steph Robb:

I guilted him.

Josh Robb:

How did we get to Petland?

Steph Robb:

That is not a part of my story. I failed my driver’s test in Indiana.

Austin Wilson:

No. So Josh told me this story.

Josh Robb:

In Indiana, because we were-

Austin Wilson:

It wasn’t the driving part.

Josh Robb:

She was an Ohio resident going to school in Indiana. But then, when we got married and we got an apartment, she had to change her residency to Indiana. Indiana has a law that you have to take the written test again for driving.

Austin Wilson:

That sounds crazy.

Josh Robb:

To get your license.

Steph Robb:

And the rules are different. The rules are not the same.

Josh Robb:

There’s a lot more horse and buggy over there.

Steph Robb:

Well, there’s just little things like left turn arrows and just different from Ohio.

Josh Robb:

We have left turn arrows here. I was just going to say.

Austin Wilson:

Yeah, you can turn left in Ohio.

Josh Robb:

So really what it was though, is it was the same written test a 15 1/2-year-old would take. So, most of the questions you missed truthfully were on getting your permit, which is irrelevant for someone who is in their twenties. It doesn’t matter. So, you missed the questions.

Austin Wilson:

You get penalized.

Josh Robb:

How many hours do you need before you take your test? Those are the questions that she didn’t study for and missed.

Steph Robb:

Yes.

Josh Robb:

So, we were then driving home and she was kind of sad about missing the exam. And so, we stopped at a puppy store.

Austin Wilson:

Josh was already beat down. He was-

Steph Robb:

Do you guys remember? Do you remember Petland? They used to be so much fun. They’d let you hold the puppies.

Jenna Wilson:

Absolutely. We had one in the Findlay Village Mall.

Steph Robb:

Yes, I remember. So, I’m like, “Let’s just go look at the puppies.” I was sad. Well, looking quickly turned into, I fell in love with this little white fur ball. Trigger was what we ended up naming her. But Trigger cost us over $1,000.

Austin Wilson:

Oh, my gosh.

Steph Robb:

And now, looking back, I cannot believe we paid that much for a puppy at Petland.

Austin Wilson:

And Josh was working at a nonprofit.

Steph Robb:

Yeah. Yeah. And that would tell you what he would do for his bride at that point.

Austin Wilson:

That’s right.

Jenna Wilson:

He wanted to help you feel better.

Austin Wilson:

Did you feel happy though?

Steph Robb:

Yes. But I also have one more, what just came to me.

Josh Robb:

What?

Steph Robb:

This actually had to do more with my business, was I remember out of nowhere, I felt like my wedding photography took off, where I remember having double-digit weddings. And at the end of the year, I had a major tax hit that I did not expect and definitely surprised me and was very eye-opening for the next year, which was good. But that was definitely a financial mistake I made, was not being better about tracking my spending and paying over the year for what I was bringing in that summer. So that would probably be my biggest financial mistake aside for buying a dog, which Trigger was my favorite dog ever.

Josh Robb:

And I’ll say, that’s something for anybody that owns their own business, is you’re required to pay a certain amount on your prior tax return to be what is called safe harbored in. But if you know you’re going to be making more, it’s better to start paying some estimates throughout that time. Because come tax time, if you get this big bill and you’ve not saved and kept that money there, it can be a stressful time. So for anybody that owns their own business, your accountant will tell you a minimum amount you need to pay in your estimates. But if you know you’re going to be making more, it’s a good idea to then factor that in as well. And that’s something that we learn from to say, “Okay, not just what did we earn, but what do we think you’re going to earn this next year to not have that surprise at the end of the year.”

Jenna Wilson:

Yeah. That’s a good one, Steph. We actually had that, too. We had that same experience, so good point. And thanks for the tips, Josh, for sure. Yeah. Big financial mistake for us was kind of what we were talking about earlier with the budgeting early on in our marriage, it just caused a lot of stress. We had an app that we chose to enter everything into it that we had spent, even if it was a dollar or whatever. What we were being taught during that time was that a budget helps you to tell your money where it’s going. But really, we weren’t giving ourselves that freedom. We were making the budget force us to do things that ultimately caused stress. And so, budgeting can be super helpful and super beneficial, but kind of how we said earlier, just make sure you do what works for you and have that open line of communication with each other. If there’s an area of spending that is causing you stress one way or the other, you have to talk about it and not just let the budget run you. That’s not the purpose of a budget.

Josh Robb:

Yeah. And it could be a spiral, because if you stress about your spending on food and you’re a stress eater, that just spirals down, because the more stress about your spending-

Austin Wilson:

That’s more expensive.

Josh Robb:

… on food, the more you’re eating.

Austin Wilson:

Back to the hive.

Jenna Wilson:

Josh is speaking to my soul.

Austin Wilson:

Yeah. And then, I think another thing, I’m not saying it works for everyone, but this is how it works for us, is you don’t need to run $5 purchases by each other. That’s something no one needs. It’s just adding complication. We set thresholds and maybe it’s $50 or $100. That’s your discretionary level. Anything over that, yeah.

Steph Robb:

So, what you’re saying, when I send Josh to the store to get milk and he comes back with four bags of chips.

Josh Robb:

They were on sale.

Steph Robb:

Yeah.

Austin Wilson:

They were on sale. We’re buying ahead.

Josh Robb:

You always need chips.

Austin Wilson:

But yeah, so we just think it bogs you down a little bit more than it has to if every dollar or $5 or $10, you’re bugging each other. So give yourself some grace. If Jenna wants to spend $50 on a pair of whatever.

Josh Robb:

That’s great.

Austin Wilson:

Or if I want to…

Josh Robb:

Buy a guitar.

Austin Wilson:

That I ask for.

Steph Robb:

Or a Blackstone.

Austin Wilson:

She was really pushing me to get the Blackstone.

Jenna Wilson:

Yeah.

Austin Wilson:

Which she’s very glad you did.

Jenna Wilson:

Eating better at home, right? See? It all…

Josh Robb:

You really came out money ahead.

Jenna Wilson:

Yep, yep. It’s all about food for me.

Steph Robb:

And I also think it can create a level of shame sometimes in your spending. And you don’t want that in your marriage, where I feel like I have to hide from Josh when I’ve bought a new pair of shoes or something like that. Now, 18 years later, I just bring those shoes home and I’m proud of them.

Josh Robb:

If you put them with all your others, I won’t even know there’s another pair, actually.

Steph Robb:

Exactly.

 

[24:03] – How Do Both Couples Manage Debt 

Josh Robb:

It’s easy. All right. So I think both of us, both families have a similar idea of debt, but how do you think about and manage debt?

Jenna Wilson:

So really, I just have to give all the credit to Austin for leading our family in minimizing debt.

Austin Wilson:

Time out. This whole episode is not supposed to be tooting Josh and my horn about leading our finances…

Josh Robb:

Austin is so amazing here. He is.

Austin Wilson:

I did not prompt her to say this. Okay, now you’re back.

Jenna Wilson:

Well, it’s true. No, he did not prompt me. But it’s also true that he has led our family very well to make purchases that don’t incur a lot of debt. So, we are really blessed that we don’t have any debt outside of our mortgage. And we like it that way because it gives us a lot of freedom to do other things. It definitely frees up food spending and extra spending.

Austin Wilson:

Fun money.

Jenna Wilson:

And extra giving, fun money that we can do because we don’t have car payments and things like that. So, we’ve chosen to live in an older home and drive older vehicles because then we have more flexibility with our daily spending and all of that. So that’s what’s worked for us. And yeah, I’m good with it.

Steph Robb:

I would say this is an area that Josh, and I were most different in how we were raised. I came from a home of two very working-class parents, and I thought everybody had car payments, house payments. So, when we got married, and Josh was very much against having, especially a car payment, I think was one of the big ones, I was shocked. I didn’t understand what he was talking about because I thought everyone had that. So, over the years, I definitely see where if you can minimize that, the stress relief and the monthly release is fantastic. But that was something that I did not grow up with. I did not understand when we got married. So that’s been a major mind shift for me.

Josh Robb:

Yeah. I think when debt was cheap or free, there was 0% financing for a while, it is hard to justify not utilizing that as a tool. But as interest rates have risen, it’s come back to what is the best use for your money, and what else could you be doing with it?

Austin Wilson:

And I think that one thing that we’ve gone back and forth on a few times since we’ve been married is credit card usage. And credit card debt is a real thing for a lot of people that a lot of people struggle with. But we’ve talked many times on this podcast, Josh and I, about how used properly, credit cards can actually be a pretty great tool, and gone back and forth from using credit cards to maximize rewards and then using only debit cards and then going back to the same thing. And now we’ve really simplified things as well, and we’re on the same page there. But it’s debt, but it’s not debt tool, right? So if you’re paying it off every month, as we always recommend so you’re not paying any interest, because those interest rates are, whoo, crazy. We think that it’s a responsible way. You’re using it to your advantage. And that’s one way that-

Steph Robb:

Our big one is our airline. We have a Delta card.

Josh Robb:

Best airline in America right there.

Steph Robb:

I agree. It’s the only airline I will fly.

Josh Robb:

With kids.

Steph Robb:

With kids, especially. But that’s allowed us to do a lot of our trips, because whether it be Josh is going to a conference and I’m just coming along with him, if we have enough points, my ticket’s free. So I think that has been something that we’ve utilized a lot in the last few years. As our kids get older and we’re able to escape a little bit more, just the two of us especially, we’ve really utilized those.

Josh Robb:

Those are the best trips, we’ve found out.

Steph Robb:

Hands down.

Josh Robb:

We’ve done a couple little getaways without any children, and oh my goodness, you forget how freeing life used to be.

Steph Robb:

I tell you what though, we just got back-

Josh Robb:

Just in the airport.

Steph Robb:

Yeah.

Josh Robb:

I’ll just go to Detroit Airport and hang out.

Steph Robb:

Like Josh did. He went to Atlanta.

Josh Robb:

Oh, yeah.

Austin Wilson:

Big round trip.

Josh Robb:

That was a round trip.

Austin Wilson:

Weather.

Steph Robb:

We just went to Great Wolf Lodge. Our kids were gifted it for Christmas. That was from one of the grandparents. They gave them money towards that. And I tell you what we now have… Our kids, we have four, oldest is 13, youngest is 5 1/2 now. It’s incredible the difference from when we went a few years ago when they were younger. We could actually sit down and just watch them have fun and play together. So now that the kids are getting older, I feel like we will incorporate them in some of more of those bigger trips.

Austin Wilson:

So you’re saying there’s hope.

Steph Robb:

There’s hope. When the oldest one can-

Austin Wilson:

We’re not there.

Steph Robb:

… watch the other children, that’s even better.

Austin Wilson:

Oh, I know.

Steph Robb:

Because that’s free babysitting.

 

[28:48] – The Importance of Investing for Couples & Families 

Austin Wilson:

Yeah. All right. So, we talked about debt. Now we’re going to talk about saving and investing for the future, something Josh and I are extremely passionate about. But curious to get your guys’ take on why investing is so important and what are your thoughts on it?

Jenna Wilson:

Investing is really important for our family. And I guess I didn’t really understand or didn’t really consider how important it would be until we had our first daughter, because she has special needs, and so we really don’t know what the future holds for her. So having some investment guidance and having somebody else help us with determining what would be the best way to save for her future, to make sure that she’s taken care of when she’s here and we’re not, is going to be something that’s so important for our family.

So, I guess, I’m a stay-at-home mom, and so thinking about the girls is most of what my mind is focused on. So, when I think about investing for the future, I mostly think about how can we set them up for success, not necessarily to set them up to provide everything that they need forever, but just to set them up for success and to help them to have a solid financial understanding. And especially for our older daughter, to make sure that she is able to be taken care of regardless of who’s caring for her, that she’s financially covered.

Steph Robb:

I don’t want to follow that.

Jenna Wilson:

Well, your experience is very different than ours.

Steph Robb:

Yeah. Ours is. So, I would say one goal, and I don’t know if this is necessarily investing for the future. Josh and I have always had a dream of having a lake house. And that is something that we’ve been very much saving for and starting the process of finding. And that’s not just investing financially in the future but investing in our family. The time spent there, the ability to, I joke, as the kids become older, the forced proximity to all hang out and just spend that time together, I think is something that we really have been working towards together.

Josh Robb:

Yeah. And with that comes back to the saver versus spender mindset, in that those shorter term, those type of goals are things that I’m not always the first to get on board of because I’m always thinking, saving for retirement, saving long-term. And then, Steph can bring me back to say, “Hey, here’s some things we can do along the way.” And things I would miss out or not experience when I’m just focused on, “Hey, I need to put all this money for later.” And there’s things you can do now because yeah, your kids are only a certain age for so long and then they’re gone.

Steph Robb:

Oh, I have an example of this one. We had a big argument about this. Our third born, Malachi, is a huge Tom Brady fan, just loves Tom Brady. And I knew this would probably be his last season. So for his birthday, he was coming to Cleveland to play the Browns, and the tickets were not cheap. And I had to twist Josh’s arm to get him to buy these tickets. And it was just one of the greatest experiences getting to see that through Malachi’s eyes.

Josh Robb:

But he watched the big screen the whole time. So, he could have done that from home, just saying.

Austin Wilson:

Yeah.

Steph Robb:

No. But little experiences like that I would say are things that Josh has such a tunnel vision sometimes on our future and what goals he has for our family. And I would say I do occasionally bring him back to earth and say, “You can’t just look to the future. You have to live in the now as well.” So this year I would say we’ve done that with each kid, taken a different trip and spent some one-on-one time. And it has just been magical. I’ve loved every moment of it, and the kids have, too. So that’s definitely something that I would suggest is not just looking towards your future because your kids are only young once. So, getting to experience those things with them now is important, too.

Jenna Wilson:

That is great advice, Steph. I love that. That’s so cool you guys got to do that. And I know you love Tom Brady, too.

Steph Robb:

I do love Tom Brady as well. So, it was also for mom.

Austin Wilson:

Yeah. I think that’s great. One thing that I think of when I think of this question is the fact that our generation is much different than other prior generations in terms of our intentionality required for saving to be able to even think about retirement. Because if we weren’t putting money aside for ourselves, we don’t have a pension to fall back on in most cases like prior generations did. So, when I think of investing for the future, I’m thinking about money that we have to set aside now looking 30 years out, or else we’re going to be working our entire lives. So that’s where I think that it’s just very important for people to have a good understanding of finances, at least a basic level, compound interest, those sorts of things. And something that I hope that this podcast provides for some young people is information that we might take for granted because we live in the industry, but it’s not common sense for most people to be able to just be extra intentional about it.

Josh Robb:

All right. So now we get to the fun stuff.

Austin Wilson:

Oh man, I knew this part was coming.

 

[33:46] – How The Invested Wives Handle The Invested Dads 

Josh Robb:

Jenna, how have you put up with Austin for all these years? And I know how Steph has, because I’m awesome and amazing and all that.

Steph Robb:

Jenna is going to be so nice and I’m so mean.

Josh Robb:

That’s okay. She’s going to get the same question.

Jenna Wilson:

Oh man, I really struggled with this question.

Austin Wilson:

It hasn’t been easy.

Jenna Wilson:

Oh, my.

Steph Robb:

No one doubts that, Austin.

Austin Wilson:

Not always.

Jenna Wilson:

Well, it hasn’t always been easy to live with me either. So yeah, I don’t know. I guess we’ve just had to learn each other. And we don’t always get it right. We fight and we don’t like to fight.

Austin Wilson:

No, we hate it.

Jenna Wilson:

Yeah, it stinks.

Austin Wilson:

It’s usually my fault.

Jenna Wilson:

No.

Austin Wilson:

Yeah.

Jenna Wilson:

But we just are trying every day to be better to each other and to do the right thing for our family and to be a team. And so, that’s how we put up with each other. He has to put up with me too.

Austin Wilson:

Well, and I think we’re rewarded for “putting up with each other.” Because I think we’ve said this since the day we got married is marriage should be fun. And we have a lot of fun.

Jenna Wilson:

Mm-hmm.

Austin Wilson:

We laugh a lot at home. We are funny, weird individuals. And look, if people would be taking a random video of something I said to her in the kitchen or whatever, I don’t know. It would be hilarious because we’re just goofballs, right? And we think marriage should be fun. And we try to have fun with each other. And we think that that’s a healthy thing.

Jenna Wilson:

Yeah.

Austin Wilson:

So, Steph, what about you?

Steph Robb:

Oh, gosh.

Austin Wilson:

I put up with Josh.

Steph Robb:

Yes.

Austin Wilson:

Every day.

Steph Robb:

Anyone who knows Josh-

Austin Wilson:

And I love it.

Steph Robb:

… knows the awkwardness that is Josh. So, when I met my husband, we were very young.

Austin Wilson:

Did he have frosted tips at that time?

Steph Robb:

No. Josh never had frosted tips.

Josh Robb:

I never did.

Austin Wilson:

Now he does.

Steph Robb:

They’re gray.

Josh Robb:

They’re not frosted, they’re permanent.

Steph Robb:

He did wear a lot of Abercrombie clothes and had the prep boy all about him.

Austin Wilson:

The double polo, did he ever pull that off?

Steph Robb:

Oh no, he did not. He did have this weird fedora hat that you used to wear a lot, and your Oakley’s.

Jenna Wilson:

Yeah, Austin was the complete opposite, country boy.

Steph Robb:

Oh, yeah.

Jenna Wilson:

With a chin beard.

Steph Robb:

Oh, no, Josh had a goatee. He had a goatee.

Josh Robb:

No chin beard.

Jenna Wilson:

Can we put pictures-

Josh Robb:

Oh, yeah.

Jenna Wilson:

On The Invested Dads? Can we link those in the show notes?

Steph Robb:

Josh had an earring.

Josh Robb:

Yeah.

Steph Robb:

An earring, I remember.

Jenna Wilson:

Oh, so did Austin.

Steph Robb:

Oh, yeah.

Jenna Wilson:

Oh, yeah.

Steph Robb:

Two, two.

Jenna Wilson:

Diamond studs.

Steph Robb:

Oh. Oh.

Austin Wilson:

Diamond studs because I was a diamond stud.

Steph Robb:

Did you have a pooka necklace? The shell necklace?

Austin Wilson:

I did.

Steph Robb:

Oh, I knew it.

Austin Wilson:

I did, but not in college. That was in high school.

Steph Robb:

Oh, God.

Austin Wilson:

But I had two earrings.

Steph Robb:

Oh, no. So, Josh and I were, what? I think I was maybe 15 when we started dating. And you were 16, 17.

Josh Robb:

Mm-hmm.

Steph Robb:

And I will say, Josh has just always been my opposite, but at the same time, my best friend. We have always gotten along so well. My strengths are his weaknesses a lot of times and vice versa. And I feel like that has helped us. But yeah, we are very blessed that we have a strong community of friends around us. I think that’s important is making sure… Someone once told me, “Make sure you have friends who love your kids as much as you love your children.” And I think we have been very blessed. So we always have that community to support us, which I think is extremely important. But yeah, no, my husband, he’s a unique individual. My little homeschooled awkward boy sometimes, but we enjoy it.

 

[36:59] – What Listeners Don’t Know About Josh & Austin 

Austin Wilson:

Yeah. So kind of along that vein, this is where you guys get to share some stuff that our listeners might not know. But what are some interesting tidbits about Josh, Steph?

Steph Robb:

Oh, boy.

Austin Wilson:

That people might not know.

Steph Robb:

Okay.

Austin Wilson:

And I probably will.

Steph Robb:

I have one, which if any of our friends are listening, they will really appreciate this one. Do you know Josh will not cross the street if it is not a crosswalk.

Austin Wilson:

Oh, I know.

Steph Robb:

And the signal is going for him.

Jenna Wilson:

Oh, I knew that.

Steph Robb:

Nowhere, nowhere.

Josh Robb:

Rule follower.

Steph Robb:

The entire group will cross, and Josh will wait on that corner until it is the right time.

Josh Robb:

I didn’t used to, but I do now.

Austin Wilson:

Safety first.

Jenna Wilson:

I love your conviction, Josh.

Steph Robb:

Do not encourage it. Do not encourage it. Yeah. Also, I have one more.

Austin Wilson:

Good, because it has to be more juicy than that.

Steph Robb:

Oh, yeah, yeah. Well, it’s not very juicy, but do you know that Josh also fluctuates between two types of shirts in his wardrobe?

Austin Wilson:

Yep.

Steph Robb:

We go from flannel to dad printed shirts.

Austin Wilson:

Oh, of course.

Steph Robb:

So he has flamingos, he has pineapples, he has donuts. So those are my two little tidbits.

Austin Wilson:

Not an extra-large, though.

Steph Robb:

He’s also, not an extra-large. Absolutely. Josh thinks that he is two sizes larger than he is at any time.

Austin Wilson:

Josh don’t follow in my footsteps.

Josh Robb:

I like it loose.

Steph Robb:

Oh. But he also has a wide variety, what, three or four different pairs of matching pajamas to our 10-year-old daughter.

Josh Robb:

Oh, yeah.

Steph Robb:

The two of them love to match their jammies.

Josh Robb:

Sloths, that’s pretty fun.

Jenna Wilson:

Aw.

Josh Robb:

Yeah.

Steph Robb:

Yeah.

Jenna Wilson:

That’s awesome.

Steph Robb:

What about you, Jenna?

Jenna Wilson:

Oh, man. So, one thing that Austin is a master of is eBay.

Steph Robb:

Ooh.

Josh Robb:

He is.

Jenna Wilson:

He can find anything on eBay. Even if it’s something that you’re like, “Oh, this is brand new. I’ll just buy it full price.” No, he can find it on eBay new for way less than it would cost anywhere else. So he has that great skill of shopping on eBay. What else about you? I don’t know. That’s one that you do really well.

Steph Robb:

He has a love of skinny jeans.

Austin Wilson:

They weren’t skinny jeans when I bought them, Steph. But I’ve had them for years, and I’ve put on a couple pounds.

Josh Robb:

Blame it on the wash. That’s what I do.

Austin Wilson:

Yeah.

Josh Robb:

Blame it on the laundry.

Austin Wilson:

It was the washer.

Jenna Wilson:

Nope. That’d be me.

Austin Wilson:

Or me putting on some pounds. Yeah.

Jenna Wilson:

Blame me.

Austin Wilson:

The washing machine. Yeah. So yeah, Steph did some beautiful pictures of our baby girl a little while ago, and I wore these jeans. They’re not skinny, they are 34.

Josh Robb:

Schmediums.

Austin Wilson:

They’re 34/34, and they’re straight leg stretchy jeans.

Jenna Wilson:

They are better than the bell bottoms he was wearing when we first met.

Austin Wilson:

They were boot cuts.

Jenna Wilson:

Oh, they were bell bottoms.

Steph Robb:

Do you realize, Josh, to church this Sunday wore a pair of Doc Martins that he took his driving test in?

Josh Robb:

They still work and they’re in good shape.

Austin Wilson:

Would you call that just old or vintage?

Josh Robb:

They’re back in style now.

Jenna Wilson:

They are.

Josh Robb:

I am cool again.

Austin Wilson:

If you hold onto things long enough, they will come back in style.

Jenna Wilson:

Oh, good.

Josh Robb:

True. We were in the car, and I remember taking driver’s ed in these shoes. So that’s 20 some years.

Steph Robb:

Yeah.

Austin Wilson:

I don’t have any shoes that old.

Steph Robb:

Uh-uh.

Jenna Wilson:

Mm-mm.

Josh Robb:

You just don’t take care of them, I guess.

Jenna Wilson:

I think that’s something that’s probably, well, I can guarantee it’s true about both of these dads that you guys all need to know is that they are amazing dads.

Steph Robb:

Yes.

Jenna Wilson:

They invest in their kids. They love on their kids. They are precious with these small humans that we have in our homes. And it would be so cool for you guys to get to see them in that light too. That’s how we see them. You see them as the financial experts. And we know that they’re that, too, but seeing them with our kids, it’s awesome. So I just want to make sure you guys know that about each of these men, that they love their families and…

Steph Robb:

Nothing is cuter than watching your husband coach a U6 soccer team.

Jenna Wilson:

Oh.

Steph Robb:

Josh is a great youth coach. He invests so much in these kids. I am, I would say to a fault, a competitive person. So, I can get to be a little much at the field. And Josh-

Austin Wilson:

Oh, we’ve seen you play ball.

Steph Robb:

Yes. Yes. Yes. Josh is the most patient person. And so, as a coach, it’s so sweet to get to see him coach the kids. However, I would say he is hardest on his own children when we’re out there on the fields, especially Malachi.

Josh Robb:

They need it. They need it. Drive them.

Steph Robb:

So.

Josh Robb:

I didn’t pay her to say that either, but I think I’ll get her a nice dinner tonight.

Austin Wilson:

There you go.

Jenna Wilson:

Ooh, it was worth it.

Josh Robb:

All right. Well, thanks for listening. Hopefully you enjoyed hearing a little bit from our wives and on how they are part of the financial picture in each of our families. And how for everybody, there’s a different approach, and what works for you is what you need to find out. And so, as always, make sure you subscribe and share this with anybody who says, “I wonder what their wives are really like and the truth about Austin and Josh.”

Austin Wilson:

They’re Saints.

Josh Robb:

Yes, that’s right. Yes. And then, if you can, leave us a review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you listen to us. And if you have any questions and would like to know more about investing, you can reach out to us on our website. You can email us at hello@theinvestedads.com. And Austin, I think that’s it.

Austin Wilson:

All right. Well, until next week, have a great week. And thank you, Jenna and Steph.

Josh Robb:

All right. Talk to you later.

Austin Wilson:

Bye.

Thank you for listening to The Invested Dads Podcast. This episode has ended, but your journey towards a better financial future doesn’t have to. Head over to theinvesteddads.com to access all the links and resources mentioned in today’s show. If you enjoyed this episode and we had a positive impact on your life, leave us a review. Click subscribe and don’t miss the next episode.

Josh Robb and Austin Wilson Work for Hixon Zuercher Capital Management. All opinions expressed by Josh, Austin or any podcast guest are solely their own opinions, and do not reflect the opinions of Hixon Zuercher Capital Management.

 

This podcast is for informational purposes only and should not be relied upon for investment decisions. Clients of Hixon Zuercher Capital Management may maintain positions in the securities discussed in this podcast. There is no guarantee that the statements, opinions, or forecasts provided herein will prove to be correct. Past performance may not be indicative of future results. Indices are not available for direct investment. Any investor who attempts to mimic the performance of an index would incur fees and expenses which would reduce returns. Securities investing involves risk, including the potential for loss of principle. There is no assurance that any investment plan or strategy will be successful.